Working as a freelancer in France
Thread poster: Richard Purdom
Richard Purdom
Richard Purdom  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 21:39
Dutch to English
+ ...
Nov 27, 2020

I'd appreciate some opinions about living and working as a freelancer in France.

I've been living and working in Portugal for a long time, but I'm attracted to the Atlantic Pyrenees and thinking about buying a place and moving there.
So I'd really like to know about the tax/social security situation. What's the best option, and how much would I end up paying on earnings of say 50K? Is there anything in particular I should be aware of?

Thanks for any input,


 
Gerard de Noord
Gerard de Noord  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 22:39
Member (2003)
English to Dutch
+ ...
What about Brexit? Nov 28, 2020

I read you're British, so I'd await Brexit before taking steps.

Cheers,
Gerard


 
Sheila Wilson
Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 21:39
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
On the contrary Nov 28, 2020

Gerard de Noord wrote:
I read you're British, so I'd await Brexit before taking steps.

If Richard is indeed British and holds no other nationality, there are a scant five weeks left to get the project on the move. I believe France allow you until June or July next year to get your registration (Carte de Séjour etc) sorted but I imagine you have to have actually moved there by 31st December 2020. You certainly do in Spain.

Although there are bound to be exceptions and workarounds, most UK citizens will find it extremely difficult to set up as self-employed around the EU from 1/1/2021 on. Unfortunately, having residency in one EU country doesn't help much when you want to move, as stopping "Freedom of Movement" was at the root of Brexit. The only advantage to having already lived in the EU is the driving licence. Holders of UK driving licences (whatever their nationality) will need to take the test locally. That applies even to current EU residents who haven't got round to exchanging their licence for local ones yet, although I think the French are taking a lenient view of that too, whereas Spain is intransigent.


Deborah do Carmo
Josephine Cassar
 
Richard Purdom
Richard Purdom  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 21:39
Dutch to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
brexit blues Nov 28, 2020

Sheila Wilson wrote:

Gerard de Noord wrote:
I read you're British, so I'd await Brexit before taking steps.

If Richard is indeed British and holds no other nationality, there are a scant five weeks left to get the project on the move. I believe France allow you until June or July next year to get your registration (Carte de Séjour etc) sorted but I imagine you have to have actually moved there by 31st December 2020. You certainly do in Spain.

Although there are bound to be exceptions and workarounds, most UK citizens will find it extremely difficult to set up as self-employed around the EU from 1/1/2021 on. Unfortunately, having residency in one EU country doesn't help much when you want to move, as stopping "Freedom of Movement" was at the root of Brexit. The only advantage to having already lived in the EU is the driving licence. Holders of UK driving licences (whatever their nationality) will need to take the test locally. That applies even to current EU residents who haven't got round to exchanging their licence for local ones yet, although I think the French are taking a lenient view of that too, whereas Spain is intransigent.


I am indeed British, but I can take Portuguese nationality if that's what the red tape requires! Brexit is a right spanner in the works, it's true, but no doubt there will be plenty of workarounds.


 
imv
imv  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 22:39
English to French
+ ...
some information Nov 28, 2020

Hi Richard,

You can assess your income tax on this institutional web site:
https://www3.impots.gouv.fr/simulateur/calcul_impot/2020/simplifie/index.htm
I think that, for one person earning €50K, the tax rate is about 15%.
For a freelancer who has the 'micro-entreprise' status, social contributions (social security, etc.) are of
... See more
Hi Richard,

You can assess your income tax on this institutional web site:
https://www3.impots.gouv.fr/simulateur/calcul_impot/2020/simplifie/index.htm
I think that, for one person earning €50K, the tax rate is about 15%.
For a freelancer who has the 'micro-entreprise' status, social contributions (social security, etc.) are of 22%.

There are other parameters that you might also want to consider:
- AFAIK, foreigners can have tax benefits in Portugal but not in France.
- The cost of living is higher in France and, for a number of products, almost twice as expensive.
Some examples:
- A café/bica costs nearly twice as much in France.
- Food is much cheaper in Portugal, and food produced in Portugal don't have as much pesticides as in France (many products are almost organic)—organic food in France costs twice as much as non-organic food, and Portuguese-almost-organic food is even cheaper than non-organic food in France.
- A public-transport card in Lisbon costs 40€ a month. In Paris, it costs €75.
- Real estate, clothing... almost everything is more expensive in France.

Regarding the registration and the tax and social security situation:
- You can check the 'Service public' web site, which is an institutional web site and a gold mine of information for any administrative procedure.
- You can also check the 'auto-entrepreneur' web site of the URSSAF.
- You can also find tax-related information on the 'Ministère de l'économie' and 'Impôts' web sites.
You can find precious information that will help you determine the type of business you want to start, such as the legal status of your business: 'entreprise individuelle', 'EIRL', etc.
You can choose a taxation system, a VAT system, etc.:
- Tax system: 'micro-entreprise', 'régime réel', 'régime de la déclaration contrôlée'
- VAT system: 'Franchise en base de TVA', 'régime réel simplifié', etc.
- Social system: 'micro-social', etc.
And much more...

The 'micro-entreprise' status with 'Franchise en base de TVA' is the simplest one to start with because all administrative procedures are simplified, but you cannot deduct expenses from your turnover (there is an automatic abatement for income tax, but it may not cover all your professional expenses). You should explore other possibilities in case they better suit your situation.
I made some calculations for my activity, and I came to this conclusion: if your expenses do not exceed 12% of your gross income, the micro-entreprise status is fine. Otherwise, you might want to consider other statuses, which might generate additional expenses (subscription to an accounting association, hiring an accountant...).

If you have anything to share about registration, tax/social security status, taxes for a freelance translator in Portugal, I'd appreciate it as I'm thinking about relocating in Portugal one day.

Best,
Ingrid

[Edited at 2020-11-28 23:19 GMT]

[Edited at 2020-11-28 23:21 GMT]

[Edited at 2020-11-28 23:24 GMT]
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Deborah do Carmo
Deborah do Carmo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 21:39
Dutch to English
+ ...
Portuguese citizenship Nov 29, 2020

Richard Purdom wrote:

I am indeed British, but I can take Portuguese nationality if that's what the red tape requires! Brexit is a right spanner in the works, it's true, but no doubt there will be plenty of workarounds.


Hi Richard,

I applied for Portuguese citizenship in May 2018 and finally received my ID card in August this year (confirmation came through just after lockdown started in March). It's worth getting for freedom of movement not just for living elsewhere in the EU but to be allowed to continue working for EU clients outside Portugal after 31 December (if you have any). Not many freelancers know we can't work outside our Member State of residence after 31 December. How and to what extent that's going to be enforced is a separate issue, but that's the legal position for British freelancers in the EU after the transition period ends.

Just be aware they are very understaffed at IRN Lisbon, and it's difficult to get updates, especially until you're given a reference number, which took 11 months in my case. Nobody answers phones and emails are only answered weeks later, if at all. Some people have managed to get their applications through a bit quicker, but you're looking at an 18-month wait on average in normal times. Shortly before I received confirmation, they introduced an online system to track the progress of your application, but again until you get that elusive reference number, you're in the dark.

Unsolicited information, I know, but if you decide to stay here, you'll be better off incorporating a company on those figures. I incorporated in January 2018, to have a Portuguese invoicing entity in case my citizenship didn't come through in time, and once you get past the first year, it's much better. Freelancing in Portugal sucks. I freelanced from 2002-2018 and only wish I'd incorporated sooner.

Hope it all works out for you!
Debs


 
Mervyn Henderson (X)
Mervyn Henderson (X)  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 22:39
Spanish to English
+ ...
French freelancers Nov 30, 2020

I get occasional rants from a French freelancer (no names) about what seems to be an amazing array of social taxes, economic taxes (?), environmental taxes, breathing taxes etc. in the country. The way he puts it, I'm content to just pop across the border every so often to stock up on quiche and croissants (quiche-and-croissant tax ...).

And a slight digression ... talking of breathing - Deborah do Carmo, as I live and breathe. Changed your name, I see, Debs! I knew your real name w
... See more
I get occasional rants from a French freelancer (no names) about what seems to be an amazing array of social taxes, economic taxes (?), environmental taxes, breathing taxes etc. in the country. The way he puts it, I'm content to just pop across the border every so often to stock up on quiche and croissants (quiche-and-croissant tax ...).

And a slight digression ... talking of breathing - Deborah do Carmo, as I live and breathe. Changed your name, I see, Debs! I knew your real name wasn't "L-L" before, and I was right, wasn't I?

[Edited at 2020-11-30 09:53 GMT]
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Deborah do Carmo
 
Deborah do Carmo
Deborah do Carmo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 21:39
Dutch to English
+ ...
Cover blown! Nov 30, 2020

Mervyn Henderson wrote:

And a slight digression ... talking of breathing - Deborah do Carmo, as I live and breathe. Changed your name, I see, Debs! I knew your real name wasn't "L-L" before, and I was right, wasn't I?

[Edited at 2020-11-30 09:53 GMT]


Haha, you were indeed! I changed it ages ago. But I rarely comment on the forums, so you wouldn't have seen.


Mervyn Henderson (X)
 


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